Trailer ??

[hewesfisher]

Sorry to hear of your new challenges and hope you can find a solution that works best for you.

[Hunter757]

Sounds like you might have a cracked block? You have water in the motor oil? Did you drain the oil and water out of the block yet if not you need asap, but if the motor is turning over and you did not drain the oil or water out of the block this makes me think of a cracked block and the water is just flowing out the side of the block. You can try and put the boat back in the lake and see if you can see where the water is leaking or try running the hose at home and see if that gives you enough pressure to show the leak. Really sorry to hear this has happened hope it is a simple fix for you.

[4n6fisher]

Yes water in the oil, got about an extra quart after only a few cranks according to the dip stick. I did not notice any water getting in running with the hose and I let that run enough to feel warm water coming out the exhaust side. Will be draining out everything this evening.
Thought either cracked/corroded block or blown gasket, but not sure (or if I even care). Any quick way to distinguish?
I believe water in bilge came from around the bottom of the outdrive as there a small gap between the seal and the transom.
We do not mind projects (and knew we were signing up for a bit with this boat), but this one just keeps going the wrong way. Mostly disappointing that this was not figured out before we spent all the time detailing, repairing, putting new parts on everywhere and rewiring.

Now just trying to find a solution to get out on the water this summer.

[Larry3215]

Unfortunately, lots of places where water can get into the oil - head gaskets, block, some intake manifolds, etc. I have no clue on your specific engine, but one of the less problematic ones is the exhaust risers. At east those are - usually - easy to get to and replace without needing an engine rebuild.

[Hunter757]

So I would pull all the plugs and see what they look like and if any water is inside the cylinders. Look for any cracks in the manifolds. Change the oil. Let us know what you find.

[Larry3215]

I should say that I am not trying to talk you into continuing or not continuing this project. I know exactly how you are feeling right now. My two brothers and I bought a project boat several years ago because it sounded like too good a deal to pass up and it looked like it wouldnt be "all that much work". We wanted a larger boat and couldnt afford to buy what we wanted if it was in good condition. We are all handy with tools, construction stuff, etc, and we are decent shade tree mechanics, so we had confidence that small doses of money at a time, and lots of free labor on our part, would get us there.

We bought a 1971 Glassply cudy with a chevy 327 and a Johnson outdrive on an old rusty trailer in a salvage yard. We barely got it towed home before the trailer fell apart.

Over the next year, we ended up replacing the brakes, actuator, almost all the roller assembly's and both axles as well as a bunch of bolts and clamps. We could have bought a new trailer for just a hair more and saved a lot of work, but we did it in bits and pieces.

We thought it was going to need a rebuild on the engine, but it ended up needing a complete replacement - block, head and everything were just too far gone. Nothing was salvageable except the heat exchanger. That was mainly because it sat with water in it for too long. We tried re-using the exhaust risers, but that ended up being a bad idea as they started leaking the second time we had it out in Puget sound and filled up the new engine with salt water. We had to get towed in and then pull the engine to replace bearings and get the crank turned. It had started to rust that quickly.

That old outdrive was constantly giving us problems and parts were almost impossible to find. We spent hours in salvage yards. One day we started taking on water so bad the bilge pump could not keep up and we almost didnt get it back on the trailer in time. The main seal around the outdrive had failed. While we were fixing that - which was a lot of work in itself, we discovered that we had dry rot in the transom and at least one of the main stringers. We had just finished replacing large portions of the flooring that were soft, building a new motor cover, adding hydrolic trim tabs, new batteries, sounder, chart plotter, etc, and re-furbishing the cabin. At the same time we had a chunk of "paint" flake off one of the main sections of the trailer and it left a large hole completely through.

That was finally too much for us. We sold the electronics and gave the boat away for free to the first person we could get to agree to tow it to his house

In between the start and the end days we did have a few years and a bunch of fun adventures with that boat, so it wasnt all bad news - and its what we could afford at the time.

[Bodofish]

No cracked block or manifold if you ran it on the hose with no trouble. one of IO seals has gone and let water in to the point it started going in the dip stick and in through the exhaust. Get it drained and dried, change the plugs and I'm sure you'll be fine. I've seen it happen on quite a few boats. Find the IO seal that's leaking. Or maybe you have a thru hull fitting that's open or maybe "The Plug"?

[4n6fisher]

Thanks for all the tips and advice, nice to hear a similar story Larry (minus any good times in the water), and eternal optimism from Bodo!
Drained out all the old oil, plugs were not too bad since they were new last fall, but did get some soot on them and looked like some water in the cylinders.
Source for the water in the engine was a failed (non existent) exhaust flapper valve. Of course it was at the only piece of rubber that I did not replace on the boat, and I should have known better as I have had several cases where the exhaust flapper failed and led to water in the engine. Although I have analyzed many of the parts on boats that fail (as part of my job as a forensic chemist) being a new boat owner I still miss some things I should know about. In my defense the guy we bought it from (total shiest-er) said the rebuilt engine had just been put in a couple years ago and you would think any mechanic worth anything should have changed out the flapper valve.
Note to all older boat owners who have not thought about the exhaust flapper, better check it. Since they see constant high temps and fumes they do deteriorate.

Will have to spray some water around the outdrive to see if my theory of leaking near the base is correct.

[Larry3215]

Sounds like the engine is probably still in good shape then. Id get new oil in it asap and let it run long enough to get to full operating temp - and stay there for a while - so any residual water can boil out. Then change the oil and filter again immediately. If you were in salt water, Id do that at least twice after my experience. You can use cheap oil for the flushes.

[Hunter757]

Follow Larry's advice on the oil changes and running the motor long enough to heat the block and get rid of any left over water and so on. Really glad your motor is ok and you should back on the water in no time!! Keep us up to date!!

[Bodofish]

[quote="4n6fisher"]Thanks for all the tips and advice, nice to hear a similar story Larry (minus any good times in the water), and eternal optimism from Bodo!
<snip>

out the flapper valve.
Note to all older boat owners who have not thought about the exhaust flapper, better check it. Since they see constant high temps and fumes they do deteriorate.

Will have to spray some water around the outdrive to see if my theory of leaking near the base is correct.[/quote]

Or maybe take it down to the ramp with some help and watch while it's backed in to see where the water is coming in. Duct tape the flappers down to make sure no water is going in there. My other thought is exhaust risers. Flappers should just keep any big splashes from heading into the exhaust system unimpeded, they’re never meant to seal out the water If you are not familiar with what a riser is, it's the upside down U shape part of the exhaust manifold that raises the water line on the exhaust system to keep the lake, river, sound, ocean from just flowing into the heads and cylinders.

[4n6fisher]

New flapper and rubber tube (riser bellows) that go from riser to exhaust hose ordered, should be here next week. Might try running with old rubber piece (taped up to prevent exhaust or water leaks) on there with hose connected to get it warmed up and dried out.
Once I have the new parts I may try backing down the ramp to find the leak if I have not confirmed its location by then. May remove riser as well for an inspection per Bodo's recommendation to see if there are other issues in those parts.
Thanks once more for all the advice.

[Bodofish]

Take your time and really grease them up, they can be really hard to get off and the new ones on. Good Luck!

[Larry3215]

You dont want to be waiting for parts. You should have already run and flushed the motor oil several times by now.

Waiting a couple of days is what ended up causing us to have to do a major a rebuild on a brand new engine after our exhaust risers leaked water into the oil.

You cant just change or drain the oil. There will be a residue of oil mixed with water and water just sitting in the engine even after a drain plus a flim of water/oil mix will remain on the parts. The bearings and cam and crank shaft and the valves and etc etc etc will rust very very quickly. If they pit,, your toast.

Do not wait.

[4n6fisher]

Was no ignoring you Larry, I did refill with oil and try to run. Problem is now it will not even start, messed around a little, but I found a solution, a different boat. Picked up a 1978 Glasply, hopefully it will treat me better. I am sure I will need some advice getting this all set up so I appreciate all the info and comments from everyone.

[18ftTrophy]

Hey 4n6fisher, glad to here you picked up a Glasply and I hope your have better luck with it. You will find all the info you will ever need about Glasply's on Glasply.org, and grteat people on there. Good luck again.

[Larry3215]

Glasply made some darn good boats.

[Bodofish]

I'm going to have to go a +1 too on the Glasply. Many of them are kind of like the old Uniflites. Monday boats were pretty heavy, a lot of extra resin and cloth but they did get lighter as the week went on.... Regardless of when they came off the line, you should have a strong hull to work with. Make it anything you want!